Comments on: Ask Vicente: Non-paying friends http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/ Share his love of design, travel, photography and art with designer Vicente Wolf. Tue, 09 Mar 2010 20:01:14 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: www.marisapellegrini.com http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2633 www.marisapellegrini.com Wed, 02 Dec 2009 07:07:17 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2633 As a photographer, I work for friends but at a discounted rate...if they are friends, they value your time and expertise. I'm sure you get the same attitude...that what you do is "fun" and can't be work. An accounts payable person at a small magazine once said to me '...but it's only a picture" when I requested payment for an invoice. My response was..."Please do not deminish what I do for a living to put food on my table." I was paid within the week. As a photographer, I work for friends but at a discounted rate…if they are friends, they value your time and expertise.
I’m sure you get the same attitude…that what you do is “fun” and can’t be work. An accounts payable person at a small magazine once said to me ‘…but it’s only a picture” when I requested payment for an invoice. My response was…”Please do not deminish what I do for a living to put food on my table.” I was paid within the week.

]]> By: Lauren http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2632 Lauren Mon, 30 Nov 2009 18:42:27 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2632 I don't "work" with friends. I'll give them free advice, tips, and let them pick my brain & guide them on designs & sometimes even come up with a general design plan, but I'm not comfortable accepting money from my friends. Ever. Which means I can't ever take them on as full-fledge clients. I think it's going to get tougher as we get older (I'm still in my 20s & none of my friends are really in a financial position to hire a designer yet) ... eventually my friends may want full-service & it's just really something I'm not comfortable giving because I can't accept their money but I can't give them a ton of free work either. I don’t “work” with friends. I’ll give them free advice, tips, and let them pick my brain & guide them on designs & sometimes even come up with a general design plan, but I’m not comfortable accepting money from my friends. Ever. Which means I can’t ever take them on as full-fledge clients.

I think it’s going to get tougher as we get older (I’m still in my 20s & none of my friends are really in a financial position to hire a designer yet) … eventually my friends may want full-service & it’s just really something I’m not comfortable giving because I can’t accept their money but I can’t give them a ton of free work either.

]]> By: Amy http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2631 Amy Mon, 30 Nov 2009 12:49:47 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2631 As a landscape designer we get this also, customers don't want to pay for your time, expertise, the design, or when they do, they want to change the plant material after we spent all the painstaking time planning out bloom times, colors, heights, etc. So aggravating! And as for working for friends, I usually say it's a conflict of interest, and I'm happy to set them up with one of my colleagues. Safe and professional! As a landscape designer we get this also, customers don’t want to pay for your time, expertise, the design, or when they do, they want to change the plant material after we spent all the painstaking time planning out bloom times, colors, heights, etc. So aggravating! And as for working for friends, I usually say it’s a conflict of interest, and I’m happy to set them up with one of my colleagues. Safe and professional!

]]> By: Valerie Wills http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2630 Valerie Wills Sun, 29 Nov 2009 21:13:07 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2630 I am so pleased you posted this.... I totally agree with Amal. I just met with a potential client, then spent a day and a half pulling together ideas, fabulous eclectic finds, etc. She didn't hire me but I have this awful feeling that she is going to use my creative ideas and try and do it herself. I feel really used! For example, I had suggested a 1920s beautiful chair and her reaction "I can get that much cheaper".... it took me a couple of days to get over this awful feeling! Thank goodness I was surrounded by family and friends at Thanksgiving to help me get over it! I am so pleased you posted this…. I totally agree with Amal. I just met with a potential client, then spent a day and a half pulling together ideas, fabulous eclectic finds, etc. She didn’t hire me but I have this awful feeling that she is going to use my creative ideas and try and do it herself. I feel really used! For example, I had suggested a 1920s beautiful chair and her reaction “I can get that much cheaper”…. it took me a couple of days to get over this awful feeling! Thank goodness I was surrounded by family and friends at Thanksgiving to help me get over it!

]]> By: todd haley http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2629 todd haley Sat, 28 Nov 2009 19:43:31 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2629 i am helping a friend with his place because we both have the same aesthetic and he makes his decisions based on logic not emotion. his place will give me something new for my site which will not be "diluted" by a client's input (you know it happens) - that being said i am charging him @ 50% of my normal hourly rate and he makes the checks out to paws chicago (pets are work saving)- a no-kill animal shelter. a win-win for everyone incl the homeless critters of chicago -! i am helping a friend with his place because we both have the same aesthetic and he makes his decisions based on logic not emotion. his place will give me something new for my site which will not be “diluted” by a client’s input (you know it happens) – that being said i am charging him @ 50% of my normal hourly rate and he makes the checks out to paws chicago (pets are work saving)- a no-kill animal shelter. a win-win for everyone incl the homeless critters of chicago -!

]]> By: Jacquelyn http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2628 Jacquelyn Sat, 28 Nov 2009 19:14:50 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2628 <blockquote cite="#commentbody-1819"> <strong><a href="#comment-1819" rel="nofollow">Amal</a> :</strong> I agree, and I learned that from a personal experience. I once gave design advise to a family member offering to do her house at a discounted price. after she got the initial ideas about how to do the livingroom. She simply ignored my proposal as if nothing happened.. I spent about 6 hours doing my homework and research… being so eager to do the job….. people are simply ignorat when it comes to understanding how hard designers work. </blockquote> I find family are the worst abusers of all...I get all the time "well, just pop by next week and help me figure out what cabinet colour, flooring and paint etc ...etc...etc.. I should go with. I'm really stuck" I say, I'm busy with work and unavailable to help out.

Amal :
I agree, and I learned that from a personal experience.
I once gave design advise to a family member offering to do her house at a discounted price. after she got the initial ideas about how to do the livingroom. She simply ignored my proposal as if nothing happened..
I spent about 6 hours doing my homework and research… being so eager to do the job…..
people are simply ignorat when it comes to understanding how hard designers work.

I find family are the worst abusers of all…I get all the time “well, just pop by next week and help me figure out what cabinet colour, flooring and paint etc …etc…etc.. I should go with. I’m really stuck” I say, I’m busy with work and unavailable to help out.

]]> By: Jacquelyn http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2627 Jacquelyn Sat, 28 Nov 2009 19:11:36 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2627 Funny my husband and I had this conversation last night...some good friends were installing all new appliances, they needed some electrical work, drywall and misc work. They called my hubby (a general contractor). He sent his guys in, the trades submitted their bills to us and we paid them. Out for dinner with said friends, she said "you're not going to invoice us for that work are you", and of course we invoiced only for the subtrades, and time my hubby spent at the job site - no management fee or admin overhead fee (it's a very small amount really). She's annoyed. C'est la vie. Funny my husband and I had this conversation last night…some good friends were installing all new appliances, they needed some electrical work, drywall and misc work. They called my hubby (a general contractor). He sent his guys in, the trades submitted their bills to us and we paid them. Out for dinner with said friends, she said “you’re not going to invoice us for that work are you”, and of course we invoiced only for the subtrades, and time my hubby spent at the job site – no management fee or admin overhead fee (it’s a very small amount really). She’s annoyed. C’est la vie.

]]> By: Bonnie http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2626 Bonnie Sat, 28 Nov 2009 18:22:23 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2626 What a beautiful bedroom! I love the colors! Your advice is very good and could be applied to those in other fields of work too. What a beautiful bedroom! I love the colors! Your advice is very good and could be applied to those in other fields of work too.

]]> By: Amal http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2625 Amal Sat, 28 Nov 2009 17:31:21 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2625 I agree, and I learned that from a personal experience. I once gave design advise to a family member offering to do her house at a discounted price. after she got the initial ideas about how to do the livingroom. She simply ignored my proposal as if nothing happened.. I spent about 6 hours doing my homework and research... being so eager to do the job..... people are simply ignorat when it comes to understanding how hard designers work. I agree, and I learned that from a personal experience.
I once gave design advise to a family member offering to do her house at a discounted price. after she got the initial ideas about how to do the livingroom. She simply ignored my proposal as if nothing happened..
I spent about 6 hours doing my homework and research… being so eager to do the job…..
people are simply ignorat when it comes to understanding how hard designers work.

]]> By: Paula Grace http://www.vicentewolfblog.com/ask-vicente/ask-vicente-non-paying-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-2624 Paula Grace Sat, 28 Nov 2009 16:31:12 +0000 http://vicentewolfblog.com/?p=1068#comment-2624 True statement and good advice! True statement and good advice!

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